Thảo luận Thành viên:mxn/2004
Hi there "Our discussion about foreign place names, for example, could be used as a source in making these pages. Most of the more developed Wikipedias have style guides, etc., so it would IMHO be a step towards attracting more potential contributors to this wiki." --> place name CAN be based in here. Trần Lê Minh 05:04, 12 tháng 4 năm 2004 (UTC).
- Well, there are many forums that have lists like that. For the most part, we (me, DHN, and a few others) have developed a consensus (I guess) of using "fully Vietnamized" versions of country names, etc. For example, Canada as "Gia Nã Đại," Mexico as "Mễ Tây Cơ," Portugal as "Bồ Đào Nha," and so on. DHN says that those are actually translations from Chinese translations, so they've been around longer.
- Of course, there aren't translations like those for every country, so I've largely resorted to a (constantly down) list of foreign embassies in Vietnam, or whatever I can find at the BBC Vietnamese's website. My last resort is to just keep the English form of the country name.
- The rationale behind this policy (if I can call it that) is that there is no real standard or widely used list of translated proper names (countries, cities, languages, even people's names). Now, all this is not to say that everyone has followed this policy; Ca-na-đa exists, after all. But I would hesitate to use the forum thread that you linked to, even if it's from a widely read forum, because there are so many more just like it, except with much different translations.
- – Minh Nguyễn 11:01, 12 tháng 4 năm 2004 (UTC)
From tuanndh: Oh, i think that when you try to learn vietnamese, please don't try learn in this way because there is no rule to determize how to use that word like "con", "cái", "chiếc" ... let think that it's a part of word for example: con dao (knife) cái nhà (house). :-)
While cái is probably the most common Vietnamese classifier, it is not an article like the in English or el or la in Spanish and should not be used as such. Generally, cái is used for inanimate concrete objects. Usually political terms already have the classifiers included so it's not necessary to add classifiers to them. Here are some additional classifiers and the classes where they would be appropriate:
- usually for animals, but can be used to described some inanimate objects that have animal characteristics (con dao = knife)
- used for compositions like songs, drawings, poems, essays, etc.
- used for stick-like objects (plants, guns, canes, etc.)
- objects that contain people (chairs, cars, ships, shirts, NOT buildings)
- used for globular objects (the Earth, fruits)
- used for book-like objects (books, journals, etc.)
- sheets and other thin objects made of paper (newspaper, paper, calendar etc.)
- an event or an ongoing process
For more examples see the Ngữ Pháp section here:
I hope that was helpful. DHN 17:02, 2 Dec 2003 (UTC)
- Thanks! I always thought that cái could be used either as "a(n)" or as "instance of." This idea of classifiers is helpful. Someone suggested to me awhile back that we start a Wikibook on Vietnamese. Maybe if we start one later on, we could use this. By the way, is the Earth really referred to classified by quả/trái? - Minh Nguyễn 16:26, 3 Dec 2003 (UTC)
- The Earth, as a planet, is known as quả đất or trái đất. Mặt đất refers to the ground and đất by itself refers to dirt. DHN 21:43, 3 Dec 2003 (UTC)
- Over the past month or so, I've noticed that my parents (native speakers of Vietnamese) do in fact use cái as an article, almost as they would in English. Could it be that certain dialects or localities use the word differently? – Minh Nguyễn 21:37, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
- Can you give examples? "Cái" is generally compatible with English articles, but it is not exactly an article. Bear in mind that "cái" is very common so for most cases it can be thought of as an article. Why don't you ask them about which cases are correct and which are not? For example, saying "cái xe" (the car) is generally not incorrect but it sounds very strange, since the more common counter for car is "chiếc". DHN 23:31, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
- I've talked with my mother about this. First of all, she's never used chiếc with xe. Also, she says that, in coversational Vietnamese, cái is used much like like an article in English. (Of course, other words, such as con, are used in certain instances.) But her understanding is that cái is not used as often in formal, written Vietnamese (which would be more apropriate for this website than conversational Vietnamese). – Minh Nguyễn 02:31, 25 Feb 2004 (UTC)
FYI, you may be interested that I started a list of Vietnam related topics in English Wikipedia. Feel free to add to it or translate over to Vietnamese WP. Thanks. List_of_Vietnam-related_topics 188.8.131.52 00:10, 3 tháng 1 năm 2004 (UTC)
Adminship at Wikisource
Kim Vân Kiều Truyện
Since you're working on Wikisource, you might want to add the poem Kim Vân Kiều to it. One place to find it is here. The annotation might be copyrighted, but the actual text of the poem is not. DHN 04:23, 18 Jan 2004 (UTC)
- I'll start it as soon as I can (probably a few weeks from now). I've found it hard to find time for any wiki other than Wikipedia lately, especially with all the new activity... – Minh Nguyễn 03:42, 8 Mar 2004 (UTC).
in formal, it is knows as "Kim Vân Kiều truyện"
Vietnamese word for "from" & Comments about your website
I noticed that you keep using "thừ" when you meant to say "từ" (from). I don't think that "thừ" is a word. DHN 06:57, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
- Doh! I'm still not used to the fact that th makes the English 't' sound and vice-versa. – Minh Nguyễn 18:01, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
I was browsing through the "Học với tôi" section of your webpage, and couldn't help myself from laughing at the links. On the left of each page, you had links in Vietnamese that were supposedly translations of what you were trying to express, but if you translate them back into English, they're hilarious indeed :-)
- Essentials: The most important thing (OK translation)
- Pronunciation: Declaration (You can say "Cách Đọc" or "Cách Nói")
- Vocabulary: Self-supporting coward dike (maybe you meant "Từ Vựng")
- Grammar: Grammar (good translation)
- Culture: Plowing (you mean "Văn Hóa")
- Sorry to have a laugh at your expense...but I hope you realize it's in good taste. :-)
184.108.40.206 07:32, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
- And I started that website basically when I started learning Vietnamese. I stopped maintaining that site long ago; now I'm focusing on the Vietnamese Wikibook, so if you find any errors like that there, please correct them. Thanks for pointing my mistakes out; I'm surprise no one's was kind enough to tell me that. When I get home, I'll try to correct that. – Minh Nguyễn 18:01, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
- Fixed. – Minh Nguyễn 21:33, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
- HELLO and thank you for the welcome back message! Since my vietnamese is really limited I do not have much to write but I do visit and check out the website every week. I do appriciate your great work I hope that there will be more people joining us. Any idea how? There is an Open source seminare coming up in Hanoi in mars and maybe they will mention the technology behind wiki.
- Ahoy, I'm just here to say chao and thanks for the work you do on the vi.wikipedia. I'm in the process of learning Vietnamese myself, although I'm at a far more basic level. I will attempt to enlist my wife, a native speaker, although she tends to shy away from bookish things like encyclopedias in favor of frivolities like shopping :).
--Ryanaxp 22:38, 18 Mar 2004 (UTC)
I noticed you put a stub message on the french wiki. Thanks ;-) Unfortunately, I "lost" my root and do not know vietnamese, but I hope I can give a little help. Cdang 07:38, 7 Apr 2004 (UTC)
- Hehe, I guess you could say I "lost my roots" too. I stopped speaking in Vietnamese at all after starting school, and I've only recently begun taking it up again, which accounts for what I and others have said about my horrible translation skills. – Minh Nguyễn 21:29, 7 Apr 2004 (UTC)
- I myself never spoke Vietnamese, although all my cousins from my father's side do (both parents are vietnamese) - I hope I will have the opportunity to learn one day (for the moment, I have a job and a PHD to finish )-:). By the way, I translated the Classifiers section of your Talk page into the french Vietnamese language article (-: Cdang 07:32, 9 Apr 2004 (UTC)
- I also translated, in the same page, the section about the names of foreign countries, in fact, it seems that your "problems" with vietnamese (what should I say for myself...) is a great source of information to point out specificities of the Vietnamese laguage (-: Cdang 10:00, 14 Apr 2004 (UTC)
- Thanks for the new examples Cdang 07:05, 15 Apr 2004 (UTC)
Hi, I'm so surpire that some handsome people from Deutchsland bother to study Vietnamese :o. Also Nguyễn, I just gonna to @%&$%$%$ you cuz your horrible spelling, but then I read this page :D. I'm sure more people will come, such as me :).
Hey, BTW who DID the button, links and stuffs ? It's SO HORRIBLE, it is Vietrish, not Vietnamese, but how can I edit those button? – Mgz 20:23, 11 tháng 4 năm 2004 (UTC)
- First of all, I'm not from Germany. I'm from the US. Secondly, only sysops (I'm one) can edit the messages (links, buttons, etc.). If you'd like to suggest a change, go to MediaWiki:All messages, find the message you want to change, and click on the link at the side that says "Thảo luận về trang này." You can edit that page with your suggestion, and I'll gladly change it.
- Maybe I should put a warning on the front page that goes something like this?:
- Warning: Frequent misspellings and horrendous errors await you. Read at your own risk. Expect to edit frequently.
- And... uh... Vietrish... lol! That describes my translations perfectly. – Minh Nguyễn 01:42, 12 Apr 2004 (UTC)
Hey, you guys! We are now writing an article about the Sino-Vietnamese War. In order to make the article more neutral, we would like to ask you guys how you Vietnamese view this war? Tell us your viewpoints on my talk page (both from government and folks). Thanks. (sorry I couldn't find any appropriate pages to post this) --Samuel 04:28, 13 Apr 2004 (UTC)
- Most of the active users here don't actually live in Vietnam, so I'm assuming that you won't find many here who know much about it. I'll try to find some websites that have useful information, though. (The facts, after all, can be used.) – Minh Nguyễn (talk, blog) 16:09, 13 Apr 2004 (UTC)
Thanks for deleting the stuff on KU. I hadn't noticed that. ku:User:Erdal Ronahi 07:58, 20 tháng 4 năm 2004 (UTC)
Thanks again for reporting the misspelling. 31.5. ku:User:Erdal Ronahi 04:24, 31 tháng 5 năm 2004 (UTC)
Elections for the Board of Trustees of the Wikimedia Foundation
Hi! Can you please translate the election notice * into Vietnames and post it prominently on the Recent Changes page of the Vietnamese Wikipedia. Once you have done that, please let me know, and leave me a link where I can find it. Thanks. User:Danny on en. 220.127.116.11 21:09, 5 tháng 5 năm 2004 (UTC)
- I tried. I'm not all too great with translating, but this is the best I could do. Others will likely come along and fix things up. – Minh Nguyễn (thảo luận, blog) 02:08, 7 May 2004 (UTC)
Orthographic choice for foreign name and words
I assume that words (not place or person names) will be in vietnamese...
Is Bâ Lê the Vietnamese version of "Paris"? I was looking for the Vietnamese version a while ago, and I couldn't find it. If this is it, thank you. – Minh Nguyễn (thảo luận, blog) 19:27, 5 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- exacty, it's Bâ Lê for Paris! u didn't know? you're welcome, i imagined that everybody knows.. an anonymous guy from here, talk about Paris in english on my fr discussion page thus i tought it was obvious, yep we have enough long "relation" with France to transform their capital city name Hada de la Luna 20:11, 5 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- Sorry, I'm not a native speaker (I find it painfully obvious from my terrible translations around here...), so I didn't know. It's just that, searching on Google, I couldn't find any results saying Bâ Lê, except a few mangled webpages. *sigh* Probably another example of how people are wrong about Vietnamese, huh? – Minh Nguyễn (thảo luận, blog) 02:23, 6 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- Well, i found things a bit strange but i didn't imagine u were the only one responsible for... :o) well i also have a look in Google, yes the first "accurate" result is for a texan "french and vietnamese bakery" (3rd page), well in Viêt-Nam there r a lot of shops as "paris fashion" "paris bakery" and so on... thus if been for a while in TPHCM or even TPHN, then ppl know what is vietnamse word for paris... that's why i explained the guy that using an internet dictionnary intended for vietnamese IT pro from silicon valley is not the most accurate to get any conclusion on our language... but internet is all, despite the fact that currently half of vietnamese citizens were born after 1975 then a lot of changes occur since... using books is not the most adapted, things r changing so quickly and vietnamese researchers r too poor to publish in foreign languages... thus oldish, oddish, and so on stuff r the only available, and if a guy is considering himseff as a "landlord" of "real" knowledge it's a pure catastrophy... i send some e-mails to friends to have a look on vi: (and even on fr, but i consider that because the guy is more french than me and use so brillantly words that french simply not see falseness behind brillant word, there is no hope on that side, the guy is defenitely a kind of landlord of all weird languages in fr) but we r in summer... one of my numerous uncle (viet way) already promisses to, when he will get a minute to.. i guess it will take mre than a minute but it would be better than nothing, i also intended to ask some vietnameses from VN to have a look (i have some university connection) but internet is so expensive for them... Hada de la Luna 04:59, 6 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- I'm pretty much responsible for the weird translations around here – though there have been some disagreements among the other users, such as whether to say chào or xin chào, or whether to use những as much as we do around here.
- What did you search for in Google? I used this search. By the way, the "texan 'french and vietnamese bakery'" is called Bánh Mì Ba Lẹ. (I've eaten there several times before.)
- When you said "internet dictionnary [sic] intended for vietnamese IT pro from silicon valley," were you talking about the Microsoft Community Glossary? If you don't consider this a good source of translations, I'll stop using it.
- I'm sorry to say I can't do much about the situation on fr:, but hopefully the discussion here on vi: will catch the attention of the occasional vi: contributor. Maybe someone will come along.
- I'd be really grateful to you for letting Vietnamese speakers know about this site. The fact that the Internet costs so much in Vietnam basically means that this Wikipedia won't take off that fast. (Even the Thai Wikipedia surpassed us awhile ago.) – Minh Nguyễn (thảo luận, blog) 15:28, 6 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- you're welcome, no i cannot access this dictionnary i'm a linuxian ;op Hada de la Luna 17:46, 6 Jul 2004 (UTC)
Ba Lê or not Bâ Lê ?
Ba Lê = Paris, it's base on chinese :) there's not word "Bâ" in Vietnamese
- well, how do you know that? according to researchers there r a lot of "empty word" with no real meaning except in composed words... or it is from orthographic rules? in that case, pay attention currently the HCM orthographic reform is partly inforced and partly not (by example, the use of f instead of ph was never put in force but the - interdiction is more or less in force which could be a lot confusing with composed words...), i would like more information on this point, Tx Hada de la Luna 05:44, 6 Jul 2004 (UTC)
it's nature, just because when you write "Bâ Lê", i don't know how to pronounce "Bâ" in vietnamese while vietnamese is my native language; actually, this word is derive from chinese ( from the way to pronounce Paris in chinese) so now it's rarely used in VietNam, maybe you can find the word "Bâ Lê" in some ancient paper (i'm not sure) but i sure that there is no way to use "â" as vowel because it isn't a vowel. today, the word "Ba Lê" is not popular but all of people in vietnam know that it is Paris, the modern Vietnamese write the word Paris as "Paris" and pronounce as "Pa ri". i don't understand what you mean about " the HCM orthographic reform is partly inforced and partly not", OK, the orthographic reform which i has learned in ABC class, had some change but i dont think it is a big problem. now there is some ancient words - which dont be used in orthographic reform - are reused for example: Bắc Kạn ( orthographic reform: Bắc Cạn, ).
- yes, but go one way then go another way is more confusing (for our purpose) than having stable way of writing Hada de la Luna 17:37, 6 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- This Wikipedia has usually uses the traditional (usually from Chinese) name for foreign countries etc. (see Gia Nã Đại). Of course, we've had our disagreements (like Ca Li vs. California). So if someone decides to write or translate an article about Paris, it would probably be at Ba Lê, Pháp (because ba lê apparently also means "ballet"), and we'd have Pa Ri redirect to Ba Lê, Pháp. – Minh Nguyễn (thảo luận, blog) 00:09, 7 Jul 2004 (UTC)
Hi Minh! i dont think that is the solution, although using "Pa ri" is pure Vietnamese pronounce but as i said beforce, in VietNam, we write "Paris" for Paris but we pronounce in vietnamese way "Pa ri". it simple and it is on the way that vietnamese treat the for foreign word (as i known) so i think that you should keep such foreign word in normal.
there is another problem with vi.wikipedia.org, that is the IT term, there are so much word which you've translated, is not correct in IT context; for example: "Save", i know that in the dictionary, it is "Để dành" ( Oh i'm not sure it's correct spell - maybe "Để giành") but in the IT context we use this term as "Lưu" - i'm a IT Enginieer, so could you like me to help you to fix some vietnamese IT terms in vi.wikipedia.org
- If you would like to help out translating (or re-translating) the interface, please nominate yourself at Wikipedia:Những người muốn quyền quản lý. Please include your username and why you'd be qualified (experience w/ the Vietnamese language, how long you've been contributing to any Wikipedia, etc.). Also, you may want to read up on what it means to be a sysop/admin. See en:Wikipedia:Administrators and m:Administrator. Thanks. – Minh Nguyễn (thảo luận, blog) 20:37, 7 Jul 2004 (UTC)
"Ca Li" vs "California" in vi.wikipedia.org
I vote for writing as "California" and pronounce as "Ca li" for short, actually we pronounce as "Ca li Phóc ni a" as formal ;)
Foreign name as it is written in the foreign language except for non-latin letters languages
If writing as in original language (i mean with all latin letters and tons and diacritics what ever language it is)
- write: Paris (Ba lê, Nước Pháp) => as Pháp alone means "law"
- write: California (Ca li hoặc Ca li Phóc ni a, Nước Mỹ)
But there is problem is for non-latin letter languages, which latin tranliteration to use? vietnamese, english, french? I would prefer vietnamese because we r in vi: Hada de la Luna 06:57, 7 Jul 2004 (UTC)
Foreign name as it is written in a third foreign language
If writing in english or french latin letters, things turn more complicated (i feel because some no ending discussion and even battles about that in fr:), which latin letter language will be chosen as a reference ? what do when there is no equivalent in these language? Hada de la Luna 06:57, 7 Jul 2004 (UTC)
Foreign name as it is written in the foreign language
- write: Paris (Ba lê, Nước Pháp) => as Pháp alone means "law"
- write: California (Ca li hoặc Ca li Phóc ni a, Nước Mỹ)
Well some search (ie: arabian, thai and chinese names) will be difficult... but it is the most neutral way to do (even if i will have some difficulties with) Hada de la Luna 06:57, 7 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- IMHO, it is necessary to know how people perform the searches. I think this is culture-dependent (e.g. some culture classify name first, other christian-name first), so the opinion of vietnamese-speakers outside Viêt Nam can be flawed (you learn to look for information at school, that's what determines the way you search).
- Concerning the name in the original language, it will be written in the text, so it will be found with the wiki search tool. I am not for a third-party foreign language, people can search in the en or the fr or the de... whatever, then use the interwiki links. It is thus important to develop interwiki links in en (I think most wiki have robots that update te interwiki link from en).
- I just would warn about the diacritics. Vietnamese speakers outside Viêt Nam will not have the facility to access the diacritics, so I would recommend a suggestion made by Hada de la Lune on fr: create a disambiguation page without diacritics, that links to the related pages. The same could be done with pronunciation pages (e.g. Pa ri would link to all the foreign names that are pronounced this way). I think it is also important to keep the old words just to allow old people that left Viêt Nam long ago use Wikipedia (my father left in th 1950's and his last long stay ended in 1971, so I think his vocabulary is from that period).
- Cdang 12:45, 8 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- Those are good ideas. I'll certainly start implementing the disambiguation pages as soon as I can free up enough time. Also, the wiki search tool is currently disabled, so it lets you search Google instead. That's not the best solution IMHO, but it'll have to do for now. – Minh Nguyễn (thảo luận, blog) 15:22, 8 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- I'm totally opposite the use of Ba Lê / Gia Nã Đại, blah blah blah. VIetnamese is evolving and use those wierd (?) words in Vietnamese context nowaday is like we use "Sex and beer" (YOU KNOW WHO x( Elizabethan English in today newspaper... thoult shall not kill, blah blah blah. I bet/bielive more people in Vietnam nowaday can recognize Paris and wonder WTF is Ba Lê? (esp the Youths, I dun see anyone 40+ contributing to vi.wikipedia). Keep the original English word is just FINE, or like one proposed - California ( cách đọc - "Ca-li-pho-ni-a" )
Another stuff : Can we add a Java - Vietnamese typing script? similar like the one at http://dict.vietfun.com/ user:Mgz p/s: is there an automatically way to add the cool stuff (time, username, weblog like ya, Minh Nguyễn?
- pp/s: One more stuff. What am I gonna do with content in Creative Commons 1.0 and 2.0 now , they ain't compatible with GFDL =/.. screws GFDL!!!
- See User talk:Mgz.
Maybe if 18.104.22.168 wants to sign in, we can name him (and others full natives) to be in a reference group about how it's currently written/said in VN... (only a suggestion, which, if adopted, implicates some rules how ppl r eligible for, what happen if some in disagree about the way of written/say, etc.)
personaly, i got a bachelor in vietnamese language and civilization, thus have some ideas about current grammar theories, history and culture, but i'm not very clear on tiny everyday stuff (which are very important on our purpose here) as i was born near Paris and live there Hada de la Luna 06:57, 7 Jul 2004 (UTC)
22.214.171.124 is Hoàng Tuân :-)
- well, please em, pay attention to be connected when "contributing" u create confusion not being... :o) Hada de la Luna 10:18, 7 Jul 2004 (UTC)
and what about my proposals? naturally afterward we will have to determine type of redirection and "full native" group rules, but it's on principles.. Hada de la Luna 10:18, 7 Jul 2004 (UTC)
BTW, I read the scheme of the Vietnamese grammar on fr (also by Hada), and one of the main idea developped there is that vietnamese is organised in class with legacy like object oriented computer languages. Well, this perfectly matches the concept of categories (Chủ đề, isn't it ?); I don't know if it would be a good idea, but it could be a way to classify the articles, e.g.
- con chó
- con mèo
- con người
- con người ức ưa
- con người dàn
I don't know whether it has practicle application nor if it is realistic, just food for thought... Cdang 13:22, 9 Jul 2004 (UTC)
PS I think such discussion would be more suitable in the Wikipedia:Village pump, but I don't know what is village pump in vietnamses.
- Well i dunno (honnesltly) because this proposal could not match with usual use to use only one classifier and not a serie of, examples were intented to make undestand how classification mecanism works before application of a rule which is that any idle word in a sentence (meaning having a redundant function according to sentence, text or even context) is simply suppressed. Maybe a full native living in Vietnam (or having leave it very recently) could have an idea about pertinence of this proposal
- Logically i would be for this proposal, but browsing on vietamese internet sites i'm seeing a lot of recent irregular forms most from han viet reviving words or from english words... --Hada de la Luna 14:13, 9 Jul 2004 (UTC)
Oh, there are a lot of problems in this articles, sorry, my french is too bad to correct it but i will try, the main mean of "category" is "mục", "Chủ đề" is subject.
- I'll fix that when I can. Also, the "Village Pump" for vi: is at Wikipedia:Thảo Luận. But whenever someone comments here, I get a nice big notice when I visit here. :) – Minh Nguyễn (thảo luận, blog) 06:23, 10 Jul 2004 (UTC)
I have tonnes of words for a glossary for computer that I wrote by myself long long time ago. May you suggest where can I copy and paste it?
D@mn, I have been so lazy lately :(
How do I upload the picture @ http://vi.wikipedia.org/wiki/AMD?. I'm totally n00b @ Wiking :(
Hi, do we have any template to do province/states for US/CAN? (with pix, motto, symbols, capital and stuff. – Mgz
- To upload an image:
- Go to Special:Upload. There's a link ("Truyền lên tập tin") on the left side of each page (depending on your preferences).
- Click the
Browse…button and select your file.
- Give a description of the image in the
- Make sure the checkbox is checked, and click
- If you want, you can go to the image's description page at
http://vi.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:filenameand insert a longer description.
- There isn't a template yet, but you can copy the code and labels from existing articles, like Ohio. Hope this helps. – Minh Nguyễn (thảo luận, blog) 16:18, 21 Jul 2004 (UTC)
Hey, check it out.. GNU Vietnam Dictionary by echip.
- 1: echip stinks
- 2: GPL = Giấy phép GNU General Publish License --> WTF?
Well, but at least they pro-open sources. They even have a online dictionary (but i couldn't find it). I'm thinking about asking them to help with http://vi.wiktionary.org/. So what do you think, Minh? If they refused I may just copy&paste their downloaded-dict into http://vi.wiktionary.org/.
- I have no idea what format the dictionary is in. But if it's in the DICT format, I have a program that will turn DICT dictionaries into something close to the Wiktionary en: format. There is a major problem with using eChip's files though: GNU GPL and LGPL aren't really compatible with GNU FDL. You might want to ask about this at Meta. – Nguyễn Minh (thảo luận, blog) 18:21, 22 Jul 2004 (UTC)
which term was chosen? "danh từ" or another one? (if another, which one?) --Hada de la Luna 15:57, 30 Aug 2004 (UTC)
- Tác phẩm, I guess. Doesn't danh từ mean "noun"? – [[User:Mxn|Minh Nguyễn (thảo luận, blog)]] 02:06, 31 Aug 2004 (UTC)
- also, but vietnamese words have a lot of different meanings... ie Nga is Moon as well russian... thanks for the word I will use it, do you know wich ones are used for biography and for bibliography in wikisource?--Hada de la Luna 05:30, 31 Aug 2004 (UTC)
- I don't think the Vietnamese Wikisource has used those words yet, so you can come up with your own. Honestly, I'm not an expert at Vietnamese (yet), and I'm the only other contributor to the Vietnamese Wikisource, so feel free to use your choice of words. – Minh Nguyễn (thảo luận, blog) 00:19, 1 Sep 2004 (UTC)
- "author" = "tác giả"
Nga is not moon, Nguyệt is moon :) Nguyệt Nga is the fairy (nymph) from the moon ( i'm not sure :-))
Hello Minh, can you give me the language file of wikipedia, i'll correct some terms in vi.wikipedia.org with the term we are using in CS and i've a plan to integrate vietnamese keystroke system to wikipedia, i'll do this if i free :) – Tuanndh 17:30, 9 Sep 2004 (UTC)
- Right now this wiki isn't using a localized language file; we're using the built-in MediaWiki system. Go to Special:Allmessages, and if you see a message that you'd like corrected, click on the entry's [Talk] link, and post a note there. I'll probably notice your message there, and I can fix the problem. If you'd like to suggest many changes at once, just put a list of the changes you want somewhere – here, even. I'll be glad to work on it. – Minh Nguyễn (thảo luận, blog) 03:53, 10 Sep 2004 (UTC)
about the HCM's article
You wrote : "Grhh, I edited a little bit as good and NPOV as I can. but I'm not satisfied :( cuz I'm still a little biased (pro-HCM :( . Anyone from "other side" care to edit?" Mgz @ long time ago
Could you develop more what you mean ?(coz my english not very good...) Thanks ! Quang
- Actually, I didn't write that. Someone else did. I fixed the page to make that clear. Sorry about the confusion. – Minh Nguyễn (thảo luận, blog) 04:47, 7 Oct 2004 (UTC)
oops, I think I'm the poor soul that wrote that message.User:Mgz
We are trying to translate a small article on the english wikipedia into every language that has a wikipedia. It is the article en:Gangnihessou would you like to make translation???? See also: en:User:Danny/Gangnihessou Thanks Waerth 17:02, 27 Oct 2004 (UTC)
- Done, though my translation was probably a bit rough. – Minh Nguyễn (thảo luận, blog) 05:03, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC)
- Thx MXN if you ever get to Bangkok I will buy you a drink! Waerth 05:10, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC)
Translation of the week
Currently we have started a project on meta.wikipedia to get an article translated in as many wikipedias as possible every week. The article will be about a subject that usually gets rarely translated and has a lot of links to other subjects. Currently we have no-one to translate in your language. If someone is interested to participate please see: meta:Translation of the week You can also submit articles from your own languages there that you think deserve translation, but have a small chance of it. The articles must not be to short and not to long and have lots of links to possible other articles! Waerth 14:27, 5 Nov 2004 (UTC)
Hi! This is Ronline from the Romanian Wikipedia. I would like to inform you that, at Meta-Wiki, there is a project running known as Translation of the week. This project seeks to translate an article into as many languages as possible every week, in order to strengthen collaboration between the different language projects and enable more article depth. The current translation of the week is Oradea, and it has already been translated into 17 languages. You can see more information here. It would be great if you could translate this article into the Vietnamese language, even partially would be great! Thank you very much, Ronline 12:05, 10 Dec 2004 (UTC)
- See User talk:Ronline at Meta.
Chào anh Minh. If I can find some time the coming weeks, I think I'm going to write some articles about the planets in our Solar System. I've copied and translated a huge and very complete table full of caracteristics of planets and moons form WikipediaEN and I'd like to hear what you think about it. I've saved it on my user page. There's a few technical term of which I'm not very sure about the translation, so if you happened know better words, don't hesitate to tell them. And don't mind all the Dutch; it's my native language so I've written all the things that have to be replaced by there correct values in it. Don't you happen to know how Uranus is called in Vietnamese? (Or do you know where to find it?) I've found all other planet names (from "sao Thủy" to "sao Diêm vương"), but Uranus seems to be fleeing me :-).
P.S.: I've copied your warning text to my user page. I doubt very much that I speak Vietnamese as well as you do. In fact I'm editing here because it seems to be needed, not because I speak the language very well. But I'm learning too. (And if I make many miss-taxe in English, please be tolerant with these ones too. It's my third language, ok! And if I want to search a word in a dictionary, I translate it from French to Vietnamese and than on to English, which doesn't work very often :-(). Lucky me I know enough French so that I don't need to translate to French first.)
Chào anh. David 23:19, 5 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- See User talk:David.
- Thanks for your answer. I have somewhat changed my table to the example of Planet Infobox/Earth. In fact there weren't many differences with the Project Astronomy apart of the lay-out, which I prefer. I also added centigrade temperature besides kelvin, because kelvin is not really in widespread use.
- About dictionaries: I've been using VDict of late (because từ điển tiếng Việt hasn't been giving me any responses for a while) and it's really amazing how many astronomical words I can find there. But there's a few missing and I was wondering if there were no dictionaries specifically for physics and mathematics và như thế đấy (just as there is one for informatics).
- David 21:38, 14 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- See User talk:David.
Các số bằng tiếng Việt
Chào anh Minh. I've started translating the article about the planet Mercury, and now I'm wondering how big and small numbers or written in Vietnamese. Like in America (12,345.678,9), like in Europe (12 345,678 9) or with a different system altogether? David 11:30, 27 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- Vietnam uses the comma (,) as the decimal mark and the dot (.) as the place separator. Thus, 12,345.6789 in the US would be 12.345,6789 in Vietnam. DHN 22:36, 27 Nov 2004 (UTC)
If I understand you well, you suggested to use the format currently used for Earth at the English site, correct?
I had no idea that there are 2 (or more) standards. Since I had planned to do all 9 planets, I thought that I would keep all the tables looking the same and just pick one style in random. Hence the last changes!
Now I have to change them - a grand total of 2 - back!!!
Damn the fleeting grey cells! (You don't mind a little ranting from an old curmudgeon, do you?) OK, will change them to the 'Earth' style soon.
What standard are we using in writing large values such as 123123123123123123 dollars and a few cents? Do we use the dot (.) to separate the integral part from the fraction? Or do we use the comma (,) to do it?
I know that for dates we use this form, say, ngày 29 tháng 11 năm 1945. But what do we use as the short form? 29/11/1945 or the more ISO-standardized of 1945/11/29?
For times of the day, I understand that we should use the 24-hour format since there are no such things as AM and PM in the Viet language.
Where do I look things up for questions such as the above? Or should we set up a 'standard committee'? (God forbid!)
BTW, this is in NO WAY to criticize you, you have done a great job, but the Viet-dictionary site you gave is not that good, you know? (Translating hydrogen into hyđrô is equivalent to throwing the work of many Viet linguists into the rubbish bin.) May I suggest a copy of Prof. Ng Ðình Hoà's many dictionaries, if you ever fancy to have a better sight into the language.
(Personally, and particularly for scientific terms, I, many times, had to involve English-Latin (and/or French-Latin) or English-Chinese, then maybe Latin-Chinese, then Chinese-Viet before I realized that I couldn't even come up with an acceptable phrase! But such is the beauty of languages, don't you think?.)
Cheers, User:Mekong Bluesman
Lê Bá Kông and Lê Bá Khanh's works are ok, for they represent the early days of English, the langguage, in roads into Viet Nam. But as you rightly pointed out, they are not up-to-date.
Time zone, in my opinion, should be translated as múi giờ.
Cheers, User:Mekong Bluesman
yes...I'm gonna take a look in this holiday season... but damn, I have to pass the final first (Enginneering is HARD.. I'm Uni student now :'(
"(Though he incorrectly said that there was once a Firefox build in Vietnamese – there never was.)" YES, THERE IS.. Vietkey group did in in there Vietkey Linux.... but it is LONG TIME AGO...
may i request wikipedia to support BBcode?
cuz i'm too lazy to learn another language now :'(
And can we inter-connect wikipedia in different languages? For example the same pix in vi.wikipedia can be use in en.wikipedia without the need of uploading another same pix? (hint: the alexander the rhodes pix)
The works of government of Vietnam is public domain, right? (similar like the works of US gov)
also - words that the Vietnamese equivalent is disputed...so plz people list the original English word beside, please!!! (for example Ca-li (California)
Since you're such a nice chap, I was wondering if you could translate this simple sentence into Tiếng Việt for me: "Hello, my name is Nicholas Shanks and I am from England." (it's for my user page). Thanks! Nickshanks 17:04, 6 Dec 2004 (UTC)
- Xem User talk:Nickshanks.
Geo- Địa chất or Địa vật?
Geology, geophysics, geochemistry... are all parts of geo-science. Geology used to study only about the soils and rocks on Earth, plus their characteristics, formations and transformations. That was the reason it was translated using the Sino-Viêt phrase of địa chất học, where chất is the equivalence to ingredient. Not much later, the soils were enlarged to plains and deltas, the rocks to plateaus and mountains. Next came the oceans, the continental plates, the mantle, the core and the atmosphere. Correspondingly, geo-science should be known as địa vật học, where vật is equivalent to thing. [For example, sinh vật (living things), thực vật (botanical things), động vật (moving things), etc.] Or địa vật học is the science that studies everything on and about Earth.
Just to let you know. User:Mekong Bluesman
- You (Mxn) wrote:
- I see your point, and I've kept your change this time. But see en:Earth science. In English, "geology" also studies oceans etc. If we use this word to mean "geoscience," how would you translate "geology," which would be a subset? Would it be địa chất học?
- First of all, geo-science and Earth science are two names of the same thing - one uses Greek root, the other one plain English. Second, oceanography, since it studies one of the many components of Earth, is a branch of geo-science (or of địa vật học). A large part of the oceans is water, one of the many chấts on Earth, so it's a sub-brnch of geology too. Geology, hence and as you rightly touched, should keep its original meaning of địa chất học. User:Mekong Bluesman
Chào Minh. Do you know what "kiều" means? Neoneurone (a newcomer, I think) says that's what we are and my dictionaries give "young girl"... Doesn't make much sense to me (a bit, though). David 21:19, 18 Dec 2004 (UTC)
- See User talk:David.
I have discovered on the French Wikipedia that a new version of Wiki software has started working. Now, though, there seems to be a problem with all our beautiful signatures. The French Wikipedia has also given me the solution I have started to apply, so that's why you (normally) see my signature correctly, but all the old ones stay the way they are. Do you have any idea of how that could be corrected (and I mean: without us going all around Wikipedia to correct them all)?
And there's also a problem with the "special caracters" bar. The solution can be found on the French Wikipedia again, but it's all informatics code so I don't understand much of it.
- See User talk:David.
Các trang MediaWiki tại sao tôi không có thể sửa được trong khi nó có nhiều mục dịch không hay cho lắm ? Nguyễn Dương Khang 07:40, 26 tháng 12 năm 2004 (UTC)
- Nhiều người hỏi về vấn đề này. Phần mềm MediaWiki khóa các trang MediaWiki tại nếu không, thì những người hay làm hại có thể bỏ đồ bậy bạ trong giao diện. Thí dụ như nếu ai nào được sửa đổi trang MediaWiki:Sitenotice, người nào có thể bỏ hình bậy vào đầu của các trang ở đây dễ lắm.
- Tôi không muốn nói là bạn sẽ làm đó, mà chúng tôi phải phòng ngừa (take precautions?) để cho website này được hoạt động vững.
- Nếu bạn thấy một câu dịch sai vào những cái trang này, thì xin mời bạn nhắn một câu vào trang thảo luận của tiêu bản đó. Cho thí dụ nếu bạn thấy gì sai ở tiêu bản MediaWiki:Currentrevisionlink, báo cho biết ở MediaWiki talk:Currentrevisionlink. Bạn cũng thể tham khảo tiêu bản đó bằng tiếng Anh, như ở en:MediaWiki:Currentrevisionlink.
- Tôi xin lỗi về khó khăn này. Nếu bạn có nhiều thì giờ đóng góp vào wiki này suốt năm, thì xin mời bạn ghi tên vào Wikipedia:Những người muốn quyền quản lý để trở thành người quản lý. Những người quản lý, như tôi, được sửa đổi những trang bị khóa, với được khóa trang, xóa trang đi, và mang lại phiên bản cũ (revert).
- Việc quản lý tốn nhiều thì giờ, mà dự án này cần vài người quản lý hơn, tại đang chỉ có ba người quản lý, trong đó chỉ có một người (Nguyễn Hữu Dụng) biết nói tiếng Việt giỏi lắm. (Tôi đang học tiếng Việt, va Joakim Löfkvist chỉ biết nói bằng tiếng Anh và tiếng Thụy Điển.)